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The new CASE skid steer

Discussion in 'Heavy Equipment & Pavement' started by ksss, Feb 4, 2011.

  1. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,142

    I am back home and the AZ desert was cold as hell. Not the minus 18 as in Idaho but cold at any rate. These machines will be released officially in a couple weeks and so I will not post any pictures of them. Let me get down to the nuts and bolts of this machine.

    Productivity: I went down there with a chip on my shoulder concerning loosing the 4.5L engine. I worked the largest machines hard, even taking my own time during other events to maximize my time in them. I am not concerned about lack of power (at least at this elevation, well see about high elevation performance), through the use of better performing drive motors the wheel torque is the same as before on comparable models. Through the use of a better design of sprockets and drives the 120 size chains are not needed as in the 465 and 450 current machines. The torque curve is excellent, recover is very fast. I left AZ totally at ease on the power plant. Considering how pissed I was about losing the 4.5, the 3.2 and 2.2 are excellent motors. The smaller machines blew everyone away by how strong they were. It is unfortunate that as Bobcat Ron has pointed out that CAT will likely be buying these engines as well. Excellent job on engine performance.

    Comfort: The new cab is excellent. The wind was blowing at about 25-30 mph. I would purposely dump the dry AZ sand and dirt into the wind to wash the machine in dust and dirt. The cab is very tight. Reportedly tighter than anyone elses cab on the market. I believe it. It is also very quiet. The room in the cab is perfect. Wide enough for room but not too wide as to not be able to see the sides of the machine. The Kubota tracked machine which was there as a comparision could have learned something from this. Ergonomics was good everything is adjustable to the different operators sizes. Heated, air ride seats are nice. The method used to pull clean air into the cab was excellent and I am surprised more don't do something similiar, especially considering how much issue CAT has had with keeping their cabs clean in difficult conditions. Visibity is outstanding.

    Control: They come, depending on model with no servos, servos and E/H. The nonservo machines were surprising to me in that they don't have as much push back as I would have expected overall not bad much better than the BC nonservo machine. The servo machines were typical CASE which is to say excellent. Short throws (relative to competition, not compared to pilots or other E/H systems obviously). The real news of course is in the E/H. Overall the system is good, it is responsive and fast. No one has brought their E/H to market and not had to continually evolve the system. I expect the same here. I was happy with most of it. However I really wanted to be able to dial in sensitivity and speed or at least give me (like an excavator) different settings to fit job or operator. That is not present in this release. I guess thats why they don't call it the CASE/KAISER skid steer.

    Serviceability: When these machines releases, you can see for yourself easier than I can explain. Even CC will like this machines serviceabilty. All can be done from the rear of the machine. All filters are easy to reach. The cab no longer is a tool free release as on the large current machines you have to release two bolts like the 430 sized machines. Servicing the machine will be a breeze. I still can have my most excellent aspirator. A great deal of thought when into being able to service this machine and it shows. A couple small things would have made it even better, this was from a mulching perspective. I brought those ideas up and who knows maybe they will be added later.

    Subjective thoughts This new series was very well done. Perfect? not in my eyes, however this machine will without a doubt grab considerable marketshare. This series will have two high flow options like the old XT did. The standard highflow will be decent, the super high flow will be incredible. This makes me very happy. One thing I noticed about this group of engineers and platform managers is these guys are passionate about this project. Not "this is my job and I need to do it well" passionate, I mean these guys get it. They very competent and I believe truly give shitt about this project. Passion about this machine at all levels was very evident and beyond what I have seen in years past. I have many examples of this, but save to say, it is definetly there.

    More to follow
  2. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,142

    A couple things worth noting:

    The Kubota was extremely disappointing to me. It was the 75 sized machine. I really thought this would be impressive given Kubota's standing in the compact market. The OROPS sucks, the machine is too wide. Push power was unimpressive, breakout was good, control system unimpressive and lift power very unimpressive. I really thought this machine would blow me away, it did not. Not even close. I am curious to see what others think of this machine. I would not own one.

    A couple of the star models as I and others saw them. The small 130 sized machine surprised everyone on how capable it was. The 175/185 were also surprising to me, they will sell a lot of these machines without a doubt.

    The TR270 which is a vertical lift track machine was very impressive. I wanted one. Very well done, excellent push power, breakout on all these machines is impressive, lift was excellent. Way more powerful than you would expect for this size machine.

    The SR250 which is a vertical lift wheeled machine. I spent a lot of time in this machine. I thought this was my favorate wheeled machine, excellent balance, excellent power. I think this machine would be very productive wheeled machine.

    After getting back yesterday, I built a machine for order, it is a TR320. They did not have this model there but after running the 270, I felt this machine would replace my 440 VTS perfectly. Whether I will take the machine I am not sure yet. My only hesitation is the work load, I want the machine, it becomes a question of whether picking up a payment book is a good idea right now. But by ordering the machine as I want it I have the option of taking the machine or they will floor it. I need to update my 9020B more than I need a new skid steer but we will see what this Spring brings in the way of work load.

    As these machines start to trickle out, they worth a demo. I look forward to hearing what others think.
  3. Digdeep

    Digdeep LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,840

    Shane....how do you think the new machines will be able to perform with the optional aftermarket highflow pressures given that they have a roughly 15% reduction in engine torque?

    BTW....great objective fedback. I hope you're right about marketshare. I'd like to see Case make a bit of a comeback. It will be difficult in my area because the Case and NH dealers are so close to each other. They may cannibalize sales off each other.
  4. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,142

    The Extreme high flow will be a CASE in house product, not a BIC product. I will PM you on the details.

    I am not sure how they plan to keep the NH and CASE dealers from killing each other. Ultimately I don't think CNH will care since either way they are buying a CNH product, the dealers of course will not be so understanding. The two product lines are not identical I was told but I don't think they are significantly different. Please dont ask me to explain that.
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2011
  5. SellingIron

    SellingIron LawnSite Senior Member
    from FTE
    Messages: 661

    Great write up, you spent some time and thought in this. What models did they have of competitive equipment to compare against the new lineup?
  6. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,142

    CAT C series, Kubota 75, BC S185 with foot controls, I think they also had an S130 but I did not get to that station.

    On the customer clinics I have attended they have a lot more competetive machines. This was to give the dealers and sales guys an idea of what is out there but not a comprehensive comparision as you see in customer clinics.
  7. Dirtwerks

    Dirtwerks LawnSite Member
    from IN
    Messages: 52

    Talking about the different controls Shane, are you saying you have an option of joystick control or the old Case style hand controls or do they also have hand/foot?

    Also I assume this machines have 2 speed as an option.
  8. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,142

    The tracked machines are E/H only.

    Wheeled machines med/large 200 and up size are servo hand controlled or E/H.

    The smaller machines are nonservo hand or hand/foot up to 185 size I believe

    I am not sure up to what size you can get hand and foot controls. They want to keep the hand/foot guys from BC and NH happy, that was evident by the way they set these machines up. So they might be available to the largest machines as well but I am not sure about that.

    Once they release this will be easier to understand. Hard to explain at the moment

    Two speed and ride control are available starting at the 175 I know. I am not sure if two speed is available on the 130-150 sized machines.
  9. Construct'O

    Construct'O LawnSite Bronze Member
    from Sw Iowa
    Messages: 1,387

    Are they going too be using the NH vertial lift, Case radial system or are they out???

    NH vertial lift(arm etc.) is close too the same as Deere,what's your thoughts there?
  10. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,142

    Its a completely new vertical lift design. There were pictures posted on here some time ago of what they looked like. Pretty radical change compared to the old machines. Radial machines don't allow alot changes pretty straight forward on that design.

    They all have longer asses, much like the BC M series. It appears that to make room for tier 4 everyone will need more room for the BS that is to come.

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