First of all, let me preface this thread by sayng that yes, I am a former employee of TG/CL. I worked many years as both a spray tech. and manager for this company. I dare say that no one within this forum has more right to have feelings of ill-will towards this corp. than I do. I know every sleazy,sordid and downright incompetent method that this place employs frontwards,backwards up and down, through and through. In 1992 when the first rumblings that Chemlawn would be purchased from Ecolab by a little upstart co. in Memphis, we all knew that big changes were on the horizon. Please remember, it is no accident that Trugreen retained the rights to Chemlawn and continued to use the logo until recently. Chemlawn was a privately owned co. until 1987 I believe (correct me if I'm wrong here) when purchased by Ecolab. Ecolab had the good sense to leave most of the management, employees and methodology largely intact but payed far too much for the business and while the business was certainly turning out a profit it could not continue "feeding the gator" and soon started courting a buyer. Many companies including BFI. Waste Man. inc. even Pepsico looked at this money maker as a potential gold mine. Suddenly Trugreen, with its aggressive marketing, poor service and scummy tactics entered the picture and purchased the company at a point of extreme vulnerability for just over a "song." TG could not believe their luck! A multi-million dollar co. snatched up with dedicated employees, proven methods, great management (which the immediately started to prune away) 2 large research and developement facilities (got one of those guys?) but a supposedly antiquated marketing philosophy. It wasn't long before they employees began to get the idea and started drfiting away. While the corp. was turning record profits and huge growth it also had cancels running out of their collective ears. I personally remember my first branch mananger at Chemlawn, irate and pounding his fist about a 12% cancel rate during a meeting. At this point , a manager with that rate would be the corporations "golden boy" and would be hailed as a inovator. While it is probably splitting hairs, please do not refer to them as TG/CL any longer. They have little resemblance to the industry leader that Chemlawn was. Most of you owe your existence to one or both. Without them, would this industry even be alive? How much influence do you think that you hold over state and federal lawmakers regarding pesticide usage? How many of you "feed" off their cancels ? How many of your customers would even know that such a industry even existed without their marketing practices? If Chemlawn was still around, how many of you could even hope to sniff some of their customers? Very few I think. To close, don't try to compete with price. They'll beat you almost every time. Most of their sales reps have neither the time or the inclination to actually measure a property so more than a little guess work goes on in that department. Find a niche, what can you do better? Service? Services they don't provide? Better results? Do something different that puts you at the top. Don't hate them because you have to compete. This is America. Built on competition. Get in there and compete! In other words.."If you can't cut the mustard, don't pick up the knife." PS Ask your local Lesco rep if he knows who their biggest client is? You know, the one that is a multi-million dollar account.