Use two 9-volt batteries (not three) in series to activate a 24VAC solenoid. It works.

 

Use two 9-volt batteries (not three) in series to activate a 24VAC solenoid. It works.

Whatcha talking 'bout big guy?
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Just trying to save a solenoid or two from overheating on too much battery voltage.

 

Just trying to save a solenoid or two from overheating on too much battery voltage.

Are you kidding me?
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it's Be Kind To Solenoids Week, doncha know

 

jim quit teasing us and just give us the lesson on the dc and ac currents

 

it's Be Kind To Solenoids Week, doncha know

More like don't blow smoke up my butt week Shoes.

Nobody's holding solenoids long enough to damage them, just bumping them to make sure they're working.

My buddy Dusty tried to short a solenoid using an adjustable DC transformer and found once the solenoid cooled down the resistance was not changed.

I've bumped many a valve open on short runs using one battery, two for longer and three when necessary.
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It works because the atomized ions in the 9 volt battery react with the coil , this produces positive energy that allows the plunger to activate .

 

Nobody's holding solenoids long enough to damage them, just bumping them to make sure they're working.

Not necessarily true. I keep an 18VDC rig on hand during winterizing season, for activating Toro solenoids when I don't have controller access.

 

Not necessarily true. I keep an 18VDC rig on hand during winterizing season, for activating Toro solenoids when I don't have controller access.

The exception, not the rule my friend from the big apple.

I would surmise one could wire a solenoid to a 9v battery for 24 hrs without apreciatable negative results.

Here's a thought, I'll wire a solenoid to a battery and you do the same. Drain the battery. We can compare the results.

Pics would be required of course.
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9 volts, meh - 18 volts, meh - 27 volts, not so meh

 

9 volts, meh - 18 volts, meh - 27 volts, not so meh

Let's see the math Mr. Meh :clapping:
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Oh please. Anyone can see that a sine wave with a 27 volt peak is delivering less power than pure 27 volts DC, and that's even before you factor in the AC impedance of a solenoid.

 

Oh please. Anyone can see that a sine wave with a 27 volt peak is delivering less power than pure 27 volts DC, and that's even before you factor in the AC impedance of a solenoid.

It'd be a lot easier to see if you showed me.

Afterall, I only got one eye.............
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http://www.tpub.com/neets/book2/1f.htm

the sine wave of AC has the effective value of .707 times the peak value

.707 times 24 volts equals 16.9 volts, which is where you get the 2 9-volt batteries in series to activate the solenoid rated at 24VAC

 

http://www.tpub.com/neets/book2/1f.htm

the sine wave of AC has the effective value of .707 times the peak value

.707 times 24 volts equals 16.9 volts, which is where you get the 2 9-volt batteries in series to activate the solenoid rated at 24VAC

Hell's done froze over lads, Boots kicked down some bonefides!!!!!

Good source, WB :clapping:
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You can do some more math to support the 18 volt recommendation. Start with a solenoid coil with a DC resistance of 54 ohms, and see what power it draws running on batteries. Power is the square of the voltage divided by resistance.

P = E² / R

18² / 54 = 6 watts
27² / 54 = 13.5 watts

 

You can do some more math to support the 18 volt recommendation. Start with a solenoid coil with a DC resistance of 54 ohms, and see what power it draws running on batteries. Power is the square of the voltage divided by resistance.

P = E² / R

18² / 54 = 6 watts
27² / 54 = 13.5 watts

You are a changed man, Boots.

BTW.

If one were to desire to hold a valve open for long durations, use a stationmaster or pro 48.
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If one were to desire to hold a valve open for long durations, use a stationmaster or pro 48.
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I'll stick to the two (not three) 9-volt batteries for winterizings. If I had to run a system from battery power for extended service work, I'd use a battery pack and an inverter to power a controller.

 

Update on battery operation. I had a job where I wanted to operate some tough-access indoor valves on battery power through a cable I added specifically for the task. Again, the rig with the two 9-volt batteries proved its worth.

However, complications with coverage adjustments put battery operations into overtime, and I didn't have extra 9-volt batteries on the truck for when they finally ran down. Lucky for me, the 12-volt battery from my mumble-mumble-brand wire locater worked just fine as an alternate source.

 

Update on battery operation. I had a job where I wanted to operate some tough-access indoor valves on battery power through a cable I added specifically for the task. Again, the rig with the two 9-volt batteries proved its worth.

However, complications with coverage adjustments put battery operations into overtime, and I didn't have extra 9-volt batteries on the truck for when they finally ran down. Lucky for me, the 12-volt battery from my mumble-mumble-brand wire locater worked just fine as an alternate source.

So you used 1 or 2 12volt?

 

I have your answer... A holding coil, or solenoid, is a current operated device. It doesn't care what voltage (AC or DC) is impressed on it as long as the voltage level does not exceed the voltage rating of its magnet wire insulation. As such, you can apply a DC voltage to an AC coil. To get the AC coil to work on a DC system requires a sufficient DC voltage be impressed on the coil so that the same amount of current is drawn as when the coil is operated on AC
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I have your answer... A holding coil, or solenoid, is a current operated device. It doesn't care what voltage (AC or DC) is impressed on it as long as the voltage level does not exceed the voltage rating of its magnet wire insulation. As such, you can apply a DC voltage to an AC coil. To get the AC coil to work on a DC system requires a sufficient DC voltage be impressed on the coil so that the same amount of current is drawn as when the coil is operated on AC
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Good job Dusty......
:clapping:
A barn door will fly given enough horse power...... (or) if it won't fit, force it...... (or) because, that's the way it is......
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How are you keeping the wires on the batteries in a series from falling off?
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So you used 1 or 2 12volt?

One single 12-volt lantern battery. That lines up with the old Weathermatic S24B solenoid being described to work with 12 VDC. It also lines up fairly well with the 0.707 conversion factor applied to the minimum must-operate AC solenoid voltage that I have seen given as 18 VAC. 18 x 0.707 = 12.7

I'll keep the 18V rig, it's smaller.