Just a homeowner here but I had an idea I wanted to share with you.

If the irrigation system is already installed when you sign up a customer could you walk the property with them and look at the head locations? Then you could notice if any were installed too high and let the customer know and they could get them fixed. Maybe then you could get them to sign off on the walk and let them know that the only reason you could damage a head was if it didn't retract properly and you are not liable for it.

I'm sure some customers could still get pissed if you said you were not going to replace it. Maybe you could offer to do the replacement as a fee.

Also, if you edge their driveway and sidewalks with a gas edger, you could damage a head with that. Been there, done that to my own. :realmad: I would think you would be liable for it.

Just some ideas.

Rinker

 

Rinker97,

I never meet with clients on their property for lawn mowing. It just isn't worth it. Customers can cancel at any time after they reach their six cut commitment. So walking the property is not an option for me.

As for sprinkler heads that are damaged by blade edgers...it is because they are installed too close to the concrete. Again, not the lawn mowing company's fault. The irrigation company that installed the head should anticipate the lawn mowing company running a blade edger along the sidewalk.

An underground sprinkler system is supposed to be exactly that...underground. If any component of the irrigation system is sticking out of the ground and is able to be damaged by a mower, the system is faulty...not the lawn mowing company.

Problem is, home owners probably won't buy this story without cancelling service. Again, if any LCO's have experience with trying to tell customers it isn't your fault, I'm all ears. I would love to start telling home owners we don't replace sprinkler heads even though it was our mowers that hit them, but I just think it would lead to a cancellation every time.

Later,
DFW Area Landscaper

 

We break them, we fix them, was always our policy. Of course, we never took any customer without a year commitment and three years was our standard. I always considered it the opportunity to place it properly and identify others that were misplaced and charge to fix those before we broke them too. If they did not want to repair others once properly identified, then your liability for a free fix had ended, in our book. Maybe the best you can do is split the cost for the broken head with both parties accepting liability, them for improper placement, your crew for not watching for obstacles. You may be able to incorporate language into your service agreement staing otherwise, but they will still press you to fix something you damaged. Look for the opportunity to add to the fix rather than walk away from it.

 

An underground sprinkler system is supposed to be exactly that...underground. If any component of the irrigation system is sticking out of the ground and is able to be damaged by a mower, the system is faulty...not the lawn mowing company.

I totally agree. I've been lucky till now. Only hit about 3-4 on different properties. Never had to pay. If I knew I hit one, I called to let them know that it wasn't retracting. BUT, last year I hit at least 6 on one property. All in the back yard. I told him before this, that they weren't working right. He hasn't said anything to me yet. But he had the system shut down, so he has to know. The heads were constantly staying up. He tried to hold back $100 from the last bill of the season, but I kept billing throughout the plowing season. Ended up paying. We'll see.

 

Rinker97,

I never meet with clients on their property for lawn mowing. It just isn't worth it. Customers can cancel at any time after they reach their six cut commitment. So walking the property is not an option for me.

As for sprinkler heads that are damaged by blade edgers...it is because they are installed too close to the concrete. Again, not the lawn mowing company's fault. The irrigation company that installed the head should anticipate the lawn mowing company running a blade edger along the sidewalk.

An underground sprinkler system is supposed to be exactly that...underground. If any component of the irrigation system is sticking out of the ground and is able to be damaged by a mower, the system is faulty...not the lawn mowing company.

Problem is, home owners probably won't buy this story without cancelling service. Again, if any LCO's have experience with trying to tell customers it isn't your fault, I'm all ears. I would love to start telling home owners we don't replace sprinkler heads even though it was our mowers that hit them, but I just think it would lead to a cancellation every time.

Later,
DFW Area Landscaper

if i damage it i replace it no charge, neglect is the only reason for hitting a head. if you are edging and come to a head that is too close, pull up and skip that area then inform the homeowner so he can arrange to have it moved, if you hit a head that is stuck up, your fualt sorry, that is just being careless about your clients interest, again step it down, mark it with a stick or flag if you have one, and inform the home owner, myself i give a quote for a service on these items because that is part of my business, the only head i have hit in 3 years was 1 week ago when i slid on a slope and scalped and destroyed the head, I replaced it for free. this is my policy and would like to think it is a standard practice for most.

 

If I've been mowing the lawn for a while and a sprinkler head is broken...the customer pays for the head.

Sprinkler heads tend to loosen over time and that causes them to stick up too high or the return springs get weak leaving the nozzle sticking up.

Either way it's the customers responsibility to maintain the irrigation system. I tell them that I can replace it for small fee plus the cost of the head. I usually carry 5 or 6 different heads in the tool box so that I can fix them on the spot if necessary. Most repairs only take 5 or 10 minutes so it's not a big deal to change them out.

I haven't had anyone disagree with the policy yet.

 

++++neglect is the only reason for hitting a head++++

I strongly disagree with that. Yes, if a sprinkler head is sticking up above the surface of the lawn, and you'd have to be blind not to see it, then yes, it is neglect.

However, I would venture to guess that very few LCO's are going to see a sprinkler head that's not retracting, sticking up above the surface of the lawn, and run it over because they neglected to mash it back down with their foot. I would venture to guess that the vast majority of sprinkler heads that are broken by LCO's are sprinkler heads that were not in plain sight when the damage was done.

I KNOW it isn't my fault if we bust a sprinkler head because there are only two reasons why it would happen: Improper retraction or poor installation.

Problem is, I suspect more home owners would disagree than agree with my reasoning, get mad and cancel service over it.

Later,
DFW Area Landscaper

 

++++neglect is the only reason for hitting a head++++

I strongly disagree with that. Yes, if a sprinkler head is sticking up above the surface of the lawn, and you'd have to be blind not to see it, then yes, it is neglect.

However, I would venture to guess that very few LCO's are going to see a sprinkler head that's not retracting, sticking up above the surface of the lawn, and run it over because they neglected to mash it back down with their foot. I would venture to guess that the vast majority of sprinkler heads that are broken by LCO's are sprinkler heads that were not in plain sight when the damage was done.

I KNOW it isn't my fault if we bust a sprinkler head because there are only two reasons why it would happen: Improper retraction or poor installation.

Problem is, I suspect more home owners would disagree than agree with my reasoning, get mad and cancel service over it.

Later,
DFW Area Landscaper

should this happen to be the case, split the cost, customer buys head, you install, that would not be unreasonable if the head was obstructed from the operators view.

 

I'm not going to throw a $1200 a year account away over a $30 sprinkler head. Things happen. Ground heaves, the mower hitting the heads loosens them up, etc. It doesn't and shouldn't happen that often.As far as the head being up against the concrete and being hit by the edger, the same thing. There is no reason to hit this. that is just too easily avoidable. If it is damaged from aeration, we don't say "it was in the wrong place,...it should have been one inch over."

 

We do not replace irrigation heads or valve box covers hit and/or damaged by mowing equipment for free. I have multiple maint crews w over 200 properties. There is no way all of my employees know ehere all of the irrigation heads are. Very seldom do we hit them, but all machine blades are at 3". It is up to the irrigation company and/or whoever installs and charges the system to make sure heads are properly functioning and are at proper grade. For renovation & core aeration, I have the clients mark all heads and boxes prior to thjis service. They use my paint stick & paint & circle all pertinent objects. If they're not marked, its not our fault.

 

Turfdude,

When you do hit a sprinkler head with the mower, how do you handle it when the customer calls you about it? What do you tell them? How often do you end up losing the client because of it?

I'm the same way...197 customers and multiple crews. There is no way we can know where the sprinkler heads are on each property. Even a solo operator doing this part time with only five lawns wouldn't know where the sprinkler heads are if they are installed and operating properly. The system is underground.

Thanks,
DFW Area Landcaper

 

Turfdude,

When you do hit a sprinkler head with the mower, how do you handle it when the customer calls you about it? What do you tell them? How often do you end up losing the client because of it?

I'm the same way...197 customers and multiple crews. There is no way we can know where the sprinkler heads are on each property. Even a solo operator doing this part time with only five lawns wouldn't know where the sprinkler heads are if they are installed and operating properly. The system is underground.

Thanks,
DFW Area Landcaper

Try making a decision on your own without airing it out on LS for once. Trial and error my boy, trail and error. Good grief.

 

I KNOW it isn't my fault if we bust a sprinkler head because there are only two reasons why it would happen: Improper retraction or poor installation.

Problem is, I suspect more home owners would disagree than agree with my reasoning, get mad and cancel service over it.

Later,
DFW Area Landscaper

Then I guess you awnsered the question of the day. Fix it or they cancel. If its not the first cut, then they should know where the ones that stick up are.

 

I will fix for free if they have a contract for the year. If it is a one time or done as needed, NO. I make enough money on year longs where the one times are just not worth it.

 

Provided we hit one, we fix it - no questions asked.
Typically, we don't hit heads as we walk the property first looking for debris/problems.
However, heads can and will stick all of the time. This doesn't mean they are defective as all sorts of anomalies can occur.
Now, I don't have 197 properties - just 35 or so.
Average size is two acres, average head count over 100, however, not counting the properties over ten acres up to eighty acres that I maintain.
Average broken head count per year, possibly as high as six.
I run multiple crews, and mandate property checking before mowing.
Once I take over a property, I inspect and determine where irrigation problems are located. Property owner/manager is made aware of these problems and then we repair at a certain cost. Subsequent to that repair, we accept responsibility for the irrigation system and damage.
An interesting question is why don't you have spare heads/repair equipment on your trucks?
You won't run into problems with TCEQ provided your irrigation number is on the truck.
Repair a busted head, without a license, and customer complains, your in big dodo with the state!

 

Refusing to fix heads almost always leads to an argument that isn't worth the time to debate. We carry a fix kit with us. A lot of nozzles are damaged by trimmers and the big mowers can break pipe by pushing heads into the ground. Not everybody uses swing joints. We try to be proactive and suggest sprinker check and flag all heads above the ground and any that is sticking and then we repair. One of our Property managers tried to argue with me that all damage was caused by mowers. I dug up three breaks with him watching and showed him that roots had cracked the pipe(thin wall). I picked my examples based on experience.

 

I don't mind replacing a sprinkler head every now and then if I hit it and its a system that normally doesn't have a problem. Some yards that the system is horrible, I have told the people that they need to have their system revamped. Some have, some havent. If they do have a serious problem, I usually tell them I won't be completely responsible for busted heads. Many times they buy the head and I install it or they will have the irrigation people install it.
I hate the old systems that used brass heads! I have a couple accounts like this and the heads ALWAYS stick up. I hit one with my Walker a while back and threw a chunk into the blower and that was $175!!!! Plus a 1/2 days lost work and all my time fixing the blower.

Like others have said, if a system is properly installed and maintained, you will never hit a head or see one for that matter. Instead of blaming the irrigation company, the lawn mowing company always gets the blame.
It would be impossible for a lawn mowing company to carry a spare head for every type of system. There are different spray patterns and different flow rates, rotors and popups, filler heads, different lenths and everything else.

 

Repair a busted head, without a license, and customer complains, your in big dodo with the state!

I immagine that happens alot?

 

Try making a decision on your own without airing it out on LS for once. Trial and error my boy, trail and error. Good grief.

Good advice there... lets just keep re-inventing the wheel.

 

The fact is: the sprinkler heads didn't self-destruct . . . someone had to have broken them. . . and that person is you. Sorry to break it to you - but your company is the reason that the sprinkler head is now broken.

When someone crashes into a parked car - do they say it was the parked car's fault (and if they do - do the police care)? Same with lawn care. If you break it - it's your responsibility to fix it.

If you don't have the time to fix it, contract someone out to do it. It's one of the expenses you have to add into your business. If you think you can't afford a couple of dollars for a few sprinkler heads, you may think about how you are currently running your business.

--Seth Goings

 

If I break it I fix it. Most of the time on the old style installs it is just a broken riser. On the newer installs it is just mashed out of the way.

If I see that a head is beginning to malfunction. I tell the client and enclose a note in the bill. This note also states that the malfunctioning head can be replaced by me now, for a small fee or replaced When damaged for a larger fee; or the client can fix them in either instance.

Most clients fix them quickly or have me do it. Then I attempt to upsell them to add irrigation maintenance to their contract. Then for the set monthly fee all they ever need worry about is buying heads as they expire. Most are thrilled to have that option. And I throw in zone coverage, head cleaning and the like quarterly.

With your new system DFW this wouldn't work I am sure, but it is an idea. $45 per quarter for irrigation maintenance billed to the card. Who knows.

 

If I break it I fix it. Most of the time on the old style installs it is just a broken riser. On the newer installs it is just mashed out of the way.

If I see that a head is beginning to malfunction. I tell the client and enclose a note in the bill. This note also states that the malfunctioning head can be replaced by me now, for a small fee or replaced When damaged for a larger fee; or the client can fix them in either instance.

Most clients fix them quickly or have me do it. Then I attempt to upsell them to add irrigation maintenance to their contract. Then for the set monthly fee all they ever need worry about is buying heads as they expire. Most are thrilled to have that option. And I throw in zone coverage, head cleaning and the like quarterly.

With your new system DFW this wouldn't work I am sure, but it is an idea. $45 per quarter for irrigation maintenance billed to the card. Who knows.

Precision,
What do you quote as the life span for the sprinkler heads? I like your idea.

 

If I break it I fix it. Most of the time on the old style installs it is just a broken riser. On the newer installs it is just mashed out of the way.

If I see that a head is beginning to malfunction. I tell the client and enclose a note in the bill. This note also states that the malfunctioning head can be replaced by me now, for a small fee or replaced When damaged for a larger fee; or the client can fix them in either instance.

Most clients fix them quickly or have me do it. Then I attempt to upsell them to add irrigation maintenance to their contract. Then for the set monthly fee all they ever need worry about is buying heads as they expire. Most are thrilled to have that option. And I throw in zone coverage, head cleaning and the like quarterly.

With your new system DFW this wouldn't work I am sure, but it is an idea. $45 per quarter for irrigation maintenance billed to the card. Who knows.

I offer the same along with spring start up & fall blowouts, this is a great add on and on top of that I get to control how wet the turf is on mow day unless it rains, no more slippery slopes when i have control.

 

If a head has a riser that has not retracted, by definition it is already broken as it has failed to function as designed. Nontheless I will change it out because it's the right thing to do. What's a three dollar head and a tax deduction worth compared to bad customer relations.

 

Bottom line: No.