Fiesta is a selective post emergent with no pre-emergent properties. It is also not considered an "organic" product. It is registered by the EPA as a Bio-herbicide and has practically no health or environmental concerns.

At this time, the only organic pre-emergent is corn gluten in either granular or liquid forms.

An organic lawn care program should be more of a systems approach than just switching products.

 

Fiesta , as Phasthound mentioned, is not a pre-em. Its cool though! I switched to fiesta last season, and although its not perfect, it is safer, and most importantly- in Oregon its not a restricted-use pesticide. Ole.

For an organic weed control program, I use corn gluten meal for my first app in spring on lawns that struggle with weeds. Keep in mind, the longer you use corn gluten meal, the more effective it becomes. That said, it still is only 80% effective at best (or so I read). 80% is a passing grade though, and combined with hand pulling of weeds, and some fiesta here and there to control patch weeds, I have found it to be an effective weed control program. It is not 100% organic, but is a far cry from dumping snapshot, preen, roundup, And speedzone on everything.

Also, as it has been said time and time again, "The best way to control weeds is to have healthy soil and dense, healthy turf."

So sling some compost on the turf too- may seem counter intuitive as a weed control method, but its just what turf needs to get thick enough to elbow out the weeds.

BTW, timing and method of application is vital for corn gluten to work. Its got to be watered in, and works best if you apply it after a spring rain, so that the "glue"ten can coat freshly germinated weeds plants and prevent them from taking root.

Good luck!

 

Justin:
Where are you located in TN. I'm up around Kingsport. There's no such thing as a organic pre-em. Consider what the pre-em is doing to the plant root.

 

Organic pre-emergent? Not exactly.

However, consider a thicker type of grass. Less prone to crab infestation. (Tall fescue and rye may not stay thick enough). You need rhizomes. Sod or overseed with a dense athletic bluegrass type. Be sure it is one of the types that claims to be so dense it is resistant to poa invasions. Talk to one of the big seed houses.
http://pickseed.com/usa/proTurf/turf/index.html

Pickseed mentions Blue Velvet and
Quantum Leap as being "dense".

Also, I don't know your climate area, but maybe hybrid Bermuda or zoysia would suit the situation better. Dense.

 

Too late to edit--
be sure you plant the seed or do the aeration, slit seeding or over seed. Control weeds the organic way--with better grass that is suited to the situation and climate.
You need to do the work and accept the check.

Bluestone claims high density also.

http://mtviewseeds.com/turf/bluegrass.php

 

I'm in an area where it's hard to implement an organic program mainly because of the wide variety of weeds and different turf types.

It's hard to find corn gluten meal in my area and I'm out of options for a pre emergent. I currently offer a traditional program and a organic based. Both programs I only spot spray weeds and for the organic based program I use milorganite and have had great results. Would I be in trouble if I do with out the chemical pre emergent in my organic based program and just apply the fertilizer?

There's a business named organolawn and they seem to have it together. I'd love to be able to offer a similar program in my area as I feel people would go for it.

I'm in the transition zone and we have mainly tall fescue, Bermuda, some zoysia.
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I am creating a program for turf using a traditional and an organic program. The only pre emergent I could really find is ICT Gluten 8. I have been using soil conditioners every six weeks in years past. But, have never tried pre emergent. My program is not completely organic and I am very trnsparent about what is going into my lawns. Everything is chemical free and safe. During summer and fall i switch over and create my own teas using fish emulsion, compost, humic acid, and bone meal as a base. It works really well and I have gotten a good bit of business from switching my overall plan.

 

Looking at possible pre emergent options..

You have one, corn gluten and it takes a long time. 80 % would be unacceptable with traditional preemergents, but it's all you got so you have to accept that and explain/sell that to the client.

Organic lawn programs are not very common in Tennessee so it is not very easy to find products in town..

Unless the price of product has come down, most folks aren't willing to foot the bill and time associated with a true organic program. The proper microbial activity has to be present to break down the fertilizer so the plant can use it. If that's not here, nothing will happen. In my area, "organic" means they don't spray pesticides. They still use synthetic fertilizer.
I'm not for or against, it's just not as simple as was stated above, switching products.

 

If you search this forum, it has been made quite clear that an "organic" lawn care program is more about changing cultural practises than switching product for product.

A 100% organic program is difficult to achieve while meeting customer expectations and price points. OTHO, a 90% organic program will work very well.

Oh BTW, Milorganite and other biosolid products do not meet the standards for
organic agriculture. Currently, there are no government standards for organic landcare programs.

 

Everything is chemical free

Hmm, Nitrogen is a chemical, is that in your program? I'm not trying to bust your stones, but "chemical free is gobbldeegook" and not true. Organic fertilizers have chemicals in them.

 

Hmm, Nitrogen is a chemical, is that in your program? I'm not trying to bust your stones, but "chemical free is gobbldeegook" and not true. Organic fertilizers have chemicals in them.

This is true. I hate the term "Organic" as it means different things to different people.

 

I got in a "knock down drag out" a few years ago when I posted advice and didn't realize I was in the organic forum. My "Nitrogen is nitrogen" comment didn't go over well. They asked me to leave.
Again not for or against, just two different animals.

 

Organic pre-emergent? Not exactly.

However, consider a thicker type of grass. Less prone to crab infestation. (Tall fescue and rye may not stay thick enough). You need rhizomes.

Riggle, this is not necessarily true. Cool season turf mixtures with certain strains of 80% TTTF, 15% Perennial Rye & 5% KBG have been very successful in crowding out weeds. These mixtures also require less N, are endophytic enhanced to resist surface feeding insect, and or more drought tolerant than KBG. These traits are very helpful for reducing the need for excessive applications of synthetic fertilizers and pesticides whether or not one choices to be "organic".

 

I got in a "knock down drag out" a few years ago when I posted advice and didn't realize I was in the organic forum. My "Nitrogen is nitrogen" comment didn't go over well. They asked me to leave.
Again not for or against, just two different animals.

Plants don't care where they get N from, however this is only a part of the story. Organic matter not only provides N but also improves soil structure & defences against diseases and other pests, reduces irrigation needs and nutrient runoff.

And you are correct that conventional and organic approaches require very different thought processes.

 

Dense grass is better. Whatever type. And you probably need irrigation. Grass that has been dried out and thinned last year or early in summer is highly prone to crabgrass infestation.

Also you can hand weed if you have a strong back and excellent stamina, (or can hire the same). Use a weed spud for dandelions. Use a keyhole saw for crabgrass once the crab has formed clumps.

If you have no choice--try to get the OK to use crabgrass control--however promise to use the safest product on the market. Something with an LD50 of 1000 or higher.

 

Oh yeah, I forgot about the "Milorganite" part of that discussion. I was vilified for using synthetics and yet they championed Milorganite!!! At that time, the EPA could not with any certainty determine what was actually in it!! There were also many problems with heavy metals and truly bad stuff you do not want in your soil!!! One EPA test was done where they put stuff in (don't remember what), shook it all up, analyzed it and COULD NOT find what they had put in it!!!

 

This is true. I hate the term "Organic" as it means different things to different people.

So true. Urea (46-0-0). Urea is carbamide. Urea has c
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This is true. I hate the term "Organic" as it means different things to different people.

So true. Urea (46-0-0). Urea is carbamide. Urea has carbon in it and can be legally called organic.
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So true. Urea (46-0-0). Urea is carbamide. Urea has carbon in it and can be legally called organic.
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Well, that's stretch some people like to use. By law, Certified Organic Farms may not use Urea. Organic foods and organic chemistry refer to two different things. Which adds to the confusion.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/organic