I need to gather more numbers on that to get a clear picture how things work.


My thoughts are that when you go from being solo to a two man crew you do the lawn faster but your overhead for travel doubles on each trip because you are paying your guy while he sits on the truck on the way to the other lawn. You are paying him while you talk to the customer about the weather and such.

As the size of the lawn grows.....the doubling of travel time becomes less damaging.

When I expand I am looking into having several one man crews.

I think that if you are paying for travel time then you need less people. Unless of course the lawn is huge then more people need to be there.


Adrian

 

Originally posted by adrianvbarrera

When I expand I am looking into having several one man crews.

Adrian

You must also remember that having several one man crews means that you will have to have several trucks, trailers, and all the other equipment to furnish it.

 

Yes I did take that into account.


I figure that taking in a second person increases your production about 30%if all else stays the same.

If the profit margin is the same with two complete outfits then that is what I will do. Rather than try to increase efficiency by only 30% and increasing overhead.



I really need to look more into this.....all my answers I'm shooting from the hip.


Adrian

 

This is a tough question....I found that that I lost money at the beginning because I did have to much work for 1 man but not enough for two guys, but I did keep picking up accounts so later it was profitable, but it was not worth the headaches employes cause from not doing it right down to paying the taxes and insurance for them...I went back to a one man operation that hires a buddy occasionally if I get behind and Im much happier and making almost as much money

 

the last service i owned, i employed 6 employees on 3 mowing routes servicing 240 accounts weekly. i now run a solo operation servicing 55 customers weekly, and i take home the same amount of $. the key is productivity, close accounts, efficent machines, and a healthy work ethic. it works for me, but has taken me a decade to get too. seems liuke i still have room for more.

 

I'm a solo and always have been (since 1989). All I can tell you is what has happened to me. I pull up to one of my accounts and there's another 2 man crew cutting next door. Same size house, same size yard with about the same amount of trimming on both lots. This 2 man crew is already cutting when I get there. I unload and edge, mow and then trim and blow. Guess what? We both leave at the same time. We both do a good job. Either I'm incredibly effecient, or the 2 man crew is just coasting along taking their time or downright goofing off. I have always felt that the most effecient operation is the the 1 man operation with the husband/wife team running a close second.

 

A solo operator can do X amount of lawns. A 2 man crew (which I have several of) can for the most part do twice as much. If I am paying my men $15 an hour (and billing at $65 an hour), won't I make more money in the long run vs. a 1 man crew?

It seems that way for the previous 9 years now...

 

You need to realize that your overhead is not going to change either. (should not) You all ready have at least one trimmer, edger, and blower. While you are mowing, the other stuff sits. Pick up another guy and that equipment moves as you move the mower.

Try this for example.

you do a $30 lawn in 30 mins. that is $60 per hour gross and $45 per hour after wages.

you and a helper do that $30 lawn in 20 mins. Thats $90 per hour gross with only an additional $15 max in wages, resulting in $60 per hour after wages(2 at $15).

If you have the right helper, as i did, we were cutting my times exaclty in half. that grosses $120 per hour and you may then want to up thier wage to $20 or so, leaving $85 per hour after wages($15 and $20).

*note, these rates are based on time spent on the lawns, since thats how i have my rates and budget set up.

You are correct in saying that your drive time cost will double, but look at the big picture.

If you mow 6 hrs per day, with 2 hours window time, that results in:
-at $60/hr billable and $15 per hour labor...... $360 gross, $240 after wages
-at $90/hr billable and (2) $15 per hour labor.....$540 gross, $300 after wages
-at $120/ hr billable and labor at $15 and $20....$720 gross, $440 after wages

** the numbers are just theoretical, but may be close.

I know what i am going to choose, hopefully this has helped at least one of you since 30 mins has just passed i should have been writing my paper with.

 

Now I only have one crew with a big mower.

Dave

 

Dave, but you have a mower that makes a 12' pass, and services accounts that mower will fit on. LMAO..............

Overhead is separate from labor.

 

At one time I had 15 employees. I sold that business and took some time off. Now that I have started back I am just a one man operator. Have been that way for the past several years. I can say that I am much happier if that counts for anything. If I want to take a day off I don't have to worry about working the guys.

Having said that I started like this. When you worked seven days a week and couldn't get your work done it was time to hire someone. Later I based it on the following: 1 employee for ever $100,000 per year in accounts. This seemed to work. Each employee here usually cost me around $30K per year. Keep in mind all we did was commercial. Had three- three man cutting crews, two- two to three man pruning crews, a full time mechanic. And they were productive.

 

i was a one man op for years.its tuff being by yourself because you can only take on so much,but if you take on the right things at the right price.you can make more being solo than with a 4 man crew.once i got my ztr i was doing almost double each day.i mowed lawns for 4 days then i did landscape stuff 2 2 1/2 days a week.now i have guys mow for me all week and i do the lawn installs retaining walls mulching work with one other person to help out.all depends on what type of work you take in

 

I understand that you can do more. with 1,2 people ect and this will increase you cost per hour. Would this also mean that I would need to raise my per hour rate or leave it the same & just be able to cut more. I would assume you need more. You have twicw the over head etc. Am I thinking this out correctly?

 

Originally posted by kaufmaninc
I understand that you can do more. with 1,2 people ect and this will increase you cost per hour. Would this also mean that I would need to raise my per hour rate or leave it the same & just be able to cut more. I would assume you need more. You have twicw the over head etc. Am I thinking this out correctly?

You don't have twice the overhead...you have twice the amount of labor expense (wages, WC, taxes, etc.) Your rent, price of fuel, insurance, equipment costs, etc. stay the same.

 

Exactly..so don't you need more per hour per cut?

 

Originally posted by kaufmaninc
Exactly..so don't you need more per hour per cut?

No.

Your manhour rate does not have to change...nor does the rate you're charging for the lawn. I get $65 per manhour for a lawn that takes one person one hour to do or two people 1/2 hour...it all works out.