lol....the CDL enforcement is mainly for big trucks, not landscapers, C'mon...state troopers are worried about 80k lbs driving around perhaps killing someone, sooo they check log books, load papers, ect, and you...but very important is your AIR BRAKES, most of the time out of adjustment and can fail in a accident...they are not hunting for 2500's or F350's with trailers,lmao.... This is coming from a CDL holder and a family of truck drivers...sometimes they dont even check the big rigs, never mind F350's with little tiny trailers....the big trucks have more GVW in one tandem axle than two f350's with lil 12k trailers combined lol....how bout some 46K rears or even 58K in some of the heavy haulers

 

lol....the CDL enforcement is mainly for big trucks, not landscapers, C'mon...state troopers are worried about 80k lbs driving around perhaps killing someone, sooo they check log books, load papers, ect, and you...but very important is your AIR BRAKES, most of the time out of adjustment and can fail in a accident...they are not hunting for 2500's or F350's with trailers,lmao.... This is coming from a CDL holder and a family of truck drivers...sometimes they dont even check the big rigs, never mind F350's with little tiny trailers....the big trucks have more GVW in one tandem axle than two f350's with lil 12k trailers combined lol....how bout some 46K rears or even 58K in some of the heavy haulers

Great advice from BJ McKay and his best freind Bear or is it Smokey and the Bandit? Hey Rubber duck please don't start singing "Convoy"!:laugh:

 

You need to check with the NJ DOT / DMV, it's different from one state to the next.

lol....the CDL enforcement is mainly for big trucks, not landscapers, they are not hunting for 2500's or F350's with trailers,lmao....

Uhh....
If you're out there every day and the GVWR rating of your vehicle + trailer exceeds the state limitations
I would highly advise getting a CDL but at the least check into the requirements.
Yes, landscapers can and do, and have gotten pulled over for this.

Yes, by DOT, no kidding.
Some states 10 thousand pounds is the limit.

It may not happen everyday, I am sure it doesn't, more than likely it also won't happen on a residential street,
but get on a state route or get around a state trooper, then it really doesn't matter when all it takes is one time.

 

argue with me if you want...but i have my class A...i won't be the one trying to explain to the nice DOT officer why i am pulling a 12K trailer without one

for a better explanation I will quote the back of my drivers license...i think it is the best explanation i have heard anywhere...and i quote

"CLASS: A - Combination > 26,000 / Tow >10,000
RST:
ENDORSE: N - Tank"

So I am from Ny and my rules may be different. I am also not sure how long ago you got your class A but that is no longer the case. The rules changed a few years ago in which case it may be good to check up on all the new rules and regs, as they are changing at a rapid rate. I know my brother got his Hazmat and the rules after 911 went crazy. Well not crazy just not how they were back in the day.

I even keep a printout of the DMV rules change notice in my glove box because I tow a 12k dump trailer and didn't want to worry about that issue.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Looking Good Lawn Service
lol....the CDL enforcement is mainly for big trucks, not landscapers, they are not hunting for 2500's or F350's with trailers,lmao....


Very wrong, a commercial truck is a commercial truck. And we all have the same rules and fines.

 

Guys the Federal Laws are set in stone.
Dirt Digger is 100% correct.Go to the Federal site and they are listed.
You will find that each state has different tolerances and adjustment to the rules.
The over 10k trailer weight is one of them.Here in Ga it is not enforced but it is against the Federal law.
Towing capacity is not an enforceable violation since most commercial vehicles do not have a towing capacity.
Also will add that if you have the trailers downgraded(GVWR wise) and you are overweight you will then be in violation of 2 things.No Cdl and overweight.
You also need to ignore GVWR as far as safe weight and go by axle weight.
If any axle exceeds there safe weight limit due to improperly positioned loads then you will be in violation as well.

Very wrong, a commercial truck is a commercial truck. And we all have the same rules and fines.

100% correct.

 

You need to check with the NJ DOT / DMV, it's different from one state to the next.

Uhh....
If you're out there every day and the GVWR rating of your vehicle + trailer exceeds the state limitations
I would highly advise getting a CDL but at the least check into the requirements.
Yes, landscapers can and do, and have gotten pulled over for this.

Yes, by DOT, no kidding.
Some states 10 thousand pounds is the limit.

It may not happen everyday, I am sure it doesn't, more than likely it also won't happen on a residential street,
but get on a state route or get around a state trooper, then it really doesn't matter when all it takes is one time.

Shoot, you don't even have to go out on a State highway down here at times. They'll get you on county roads. And they look for things like duallys with large equipment trailers too. $$$$$$$ is the motive in some cases.

 

This is coming from a CDL holder and a family of truck drivers...sometimes they dont even check the big rigs, never mind F350's with little tiny trailers....the big trucks have more GVW in one tandem axle than two f350's with lil 12k trailers combined lol....how bout some 46K rears or even 58K in some of the heavy haulers

One more thing ...

That little tiny trailer behind my D-2500 weighs 1500 empty, and I know you're still laughing so listen while I tell you
that all single axle trailers I know of come without brakes from the factory, and most owners never install aftermarket.
That's right, a LOT of landscape trailers don't have brakes!
No, because to install decent brakes would cost as much as the trailer did, just about.

My truck weighs 4 or 5,000 pounds empty, add about 500 to a thousand pounds for the truck box, the tools within,
and all the crap inside the bed, to include spare tire and jack and 2-cyclers and another, portable toolbox.

Then I load my Ztr which adds another 1,500 pounds and if I load a Wb behind that I just added another 300 then
I sit in the cab and add 200 more for a nice even 2000.

So I am plowing down the road with a total weight of 8 or 9 thousand pounds and I have four tires with brakes
that have to stop all of this, only the rear brakes have ABS.
Tell me, if I made your car two to three times as heavy as it is now, would you have any issues stopping?

Do you realize there are days 18 wheelers out accelerate and out brake me?

Yes, and I'm hardly at half the puny little pickup truck's max. rated tow capacity.

....
No, they are serious about this.

 

hmmm, interesting, I totally understand your point and respect it. However, you do see mine aswell. Best bet is to maintain your truck and whatever trailer you use in safe condition and drive slow and you will be fine. No truck should be going over 60 according to towing guides with small trailers anyways, ie(non class 8)....ohh, and I totally understand your point with single axle trailers not having brakes, that is why I prefer to buy tandems even if I dont need them, they are much easier on the truck.

 

Ok, I'm gonna argue with Dirt Digger. (have my Class A as well, for reasons I've stated already)

I don't see what is unclear about this sentence, (This Federal law applies in KY also and I assume MOST every State for a Class A)---->

a) a combination of vehicles with a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 or more pounds, provided the vehicle being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.

Straight from the PA manual!

http://www.dot4.state.pa.us/pdotforms/fact_sheets/fs-cdl.pdf

WHERE does it say anything about a just a CDL for a trailer over 10,000# ??? I doesn't.

Again, the key word here is "PROVIDED" ..... That over-10,000# trailer HAS TO push you over 26,000# in combo with the tow vehicle.

If there is some law in PA I don't know about, just reserved for trailers over 10,000#, then I am wrong. But I can't find it anywhere. The Class A rule is the same everywhere.

 

Wow.......I'm going thru the same thing now....in CT ! My FRR has a GVW of 19,500# and the trailer I've been using is a 5T registered at 9980#'s to avoid the CDL / A testing.

Unfortunately my CT 322 weighs 8,600 lbs and is overweight on my non cdl trailer. So now I'm in the same boat.

My question..........(which I will get answered tomorrow when I stop by the DMV office)

is " can take the test in my non-CDL class truck and 16k trailer since this is the vehicle and trailer combination that is in question."

I'll let you guys know what my local DMV official says.

DirtDigger2 is correct with all his input except the note about the 2500 and 14K trailer ( law says any combination over 26,000K )and the acceptance of a Class A nationwide is the way to go and I'm guessing that it will be the path I'll need to take....minus the airbrake portion of the test.

Yes you can take the test on any combo over 26001 and get a class A I used a 16000lb truck and12000lb trailer = 28000lbs. Now i can drive any truck up to 26000lbs with any trailer the truck can pull legally. My truck has no GCWR only gvwr on the door. My hitch is good for 16500 but trailer max in the owners manual is 12500?

I had a simulated test on line to help me practice . Once i passed the test 3 times with a 80% average on line . I went down to take the real one .I aced the whole CDL test with only a few wrong . There was a azz load of info to remember . The driving test was 11/2 hrs long but i passed with out a problem . Ive been driving my truck and trailer for a long time . The bad news is a friend of mine is giving me his old dump and trailer cheep it 33, 000 lb gvwr and i have to take the test again Bummer .

 

Ok, I'm gonna argue with Dirt Digger. (have my Class A as well, for reasons I've stated already)

I don't see what is unclear about this sentence, (This Federal law applies in KY also and I assume MOST every State for a Class A)---->

a) a combination of vehicles with a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 or more pounds, provided the vehicle being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.

Straight from the PA manual!

http://www.dot4.state.pa.us/pdotforms/fact_sheets/fs-cdl.pdf

WHERE does it say anything about a just a CDL for a trailer over 10,000# ??? I doesn't.

Again, the key word here is "PROVIDED" ..... That over-10,000# trailer HAS TO push you over 26,000# in combo with the tow vehicle.

If there is some law in PA I don't know about, just reserved for trailers over 10,000#, then I am wrong. But I can't find it anywhere. The Class A rule is the same everywhere.

In NY they word the phrase differently and say it in 3 diffrent places in the book . My MV CDL hand book is diffrent then there web site . but ive allways been OK with a 12000ld trailer on my F350. So far. Im sure my DOT officer will find some thing elce to ticket me for . The guys gota eat .

 

Yes you can take the test on any combo over 26001 and get a class A I used a 16000lb truck and12000lb trailer = 28000lbs. Now i can drive any truck up to 26000lbs with any trailer the truck can pull legally. My truck has no GCWR only gvwr on the door. My hitch is good for 16500 but trailer max in the owners manual is 12500?

I had a simulated test on line to help me practice . Once i passed the test 3 times with a 80% average on line . I went down to take the real one .I aced the whole CDL test with only a few wrong . There was a azz load of info to remember . The driving test was 11/2 hrs long but i passed with out a problem . Ive been driving my truck and trailer for a long time . The bad news is a friend of mine is giving me his old dump and trailer cheep it 33, 000 lb gvwr and i have to take the test again Bummer .

your not making sense do you have a class "A" already? if so you dont need to retake the test just because you are now in a bigger truck.
when i took mine the truck and trailer together only had a GCWR of about 33K but that is all it takes i have driven semi that permited for over 100K since and been thru the chick coop a few times and inspected more than once.

 

Lots of difference of opinions here, so I will stick with NY rules for now, and it does sound like the New Yorkers on board might not fully understand the rules. Of course the guys with the CDL are ok

New York - you can use a truck up to 25,999 lbs (they say 26,000 but not over), without the need for a CDL. You can use a trailer up to 9,999 lbs without the need for a CDL. You can use both together without the need for a CDL (yes the combined weight is more than 26k, but they judge them as individual since both are under).
In NYS once the trailer is over 10k, you need to have a CDL. Its the trailer that wags the dog in this case in New York State...
Its the #1 reason they lower the limits on trailer registrations to show under 10k in this state. The trailer has the cuts for 12k, but its registered for under 10k. Just ask any trailer dealer who does this daily, or any construction equipment dealership. They ahve to be up on this daily...

There is a member in this thread that uses a 12k trailer in NYS - if he dosent have a CDL, then he is at risk....

 

Wow.......I'm going thru the same thing now....in CT ! My FRR has a GVW of 19,500# and the trailer I've been using is a 5T registered at 9980#'s to avoid the CDL / A testing.

Unfortunately my CT 322 weighs 8,600 lbs and is overweight on my non cdl trailer. So now I'm in the same boat.

My question..........(which I will get answered tomorrow when I stop by the DMV office)

is " can take the test in my non-CDL class truck and 16k trailer since this is the vehicle and trailer combination that is in question."

I'll let you guys know what my local DMV official says.

DirtDigger2 is correct with all his input except the note about the 2500 and 14K trailer ( law says any combination over 26,000K )and the acceptance of a Class A nationwide is the way to go and I'm guessing that it will be the path I'll need to take....minus the airbrake portion of the test.

Shed some weight off of the CT 322 and put it in your truck - the loader bucket on that machine is likely more than 600lbs....you might have something else that can be removed easily and placed in the truck. You just made yourself in compliance

 

I attached a CDL breakdown along with some contacts that you can contact for more clarity -

This will help the NYS guys only - PA seems to be more realisitic and flexible and allows you a heavier trailer ( Im jealous). Looks like NJ could be more closer to NYS than not - but I dont know for sure

 

I attached a CDL breakdown along with some contacts that you can contact for more clarity -

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=136504&d=1234979366
http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=136505&d=1234979378

This will help the NYS guys only - PA seems to be more realisitic and flexible and allows you a heavier trailer ( Im jealous). Looks like NJ could be more closer to NYS than not - but I dont know for sure

The 1st pdf that you posted goes counter to what you said.

Lots of difference of opinions here, so I will stick with NY rules for now, and it does sound like the New Yorkers on board might not fully understand the rules. Of course the guys with the CDL are ok

New York - you can use a truck up to 25,999 lbs (they say 26,000 but not over), without the need for a CDL. You can use a trailer up to 9,999 lbs without the need for a CDL. You can use both together without the need for a CDL (yes the combined weight is more than 26k, but they judge them as individual since both are under).
In NYS once the trailer is over 10k, you need to have a CDL. Its the trailer that wags the dog in this case in New York State...
Its the #1 reason they lower the limits on trailer registrations to show under 10k in this state. The trailer has the cuts for 12k, but its registered for under 10k. Just ask any trailer dealer who does this daily, or any construction equipment dealership. They ahve to be up on this daily...

There is a member in this thread that uses a 12k trailer in NYS - if he dosent have a CDL, then he is at risk....

The CDL isn't required for a 12K trailer unless you are over 26K per your 1st pdf. Which is what the Fed law says. You have to get to the 26K+1 GCWR before a CDL is required by weight. At 26K+1 and a 10K+1 trailer you are at a Class A CDL. At 26K+1 and a 8K trailer you are at a Class B CDL.

 

The 1st pdf that you posted goes counter to what you said.

The CDL isn't required for a 12K trailer unless you are over 26K per your 1st pdf. Which is what the Fed law says. You have to get to the 26K+1 GCWR before a CDL is required by weight. At 26K+1 and a 10K+1 trailer you are at a Class A CDL. At 26K+1 and a 8K trailer you are at a Class B CDL.

where you live maybe? not in New York...read the print, once the trailer is over 10k, your in CDL land period. The tail wags the dog in NY and other locations. Dosent matter what the truck towing it is at that point.

Take it up with the contact name for further clarity - but how I wrote it here and said it is consistant

 

Ok......stopped at my local CT DMV office today....spoke with an inspector. In CT, as with every other state according to federal laws governing CDL's......I do need a CDL for my combination which as mentioned before is a commercial non CDL truck registered with a GVW of 19,500 lbs and a trailer of 14,000 lbs GVW.

I can take the test with my truck and trailer combo but this will give me a CLASS A with a "L" endorsement which is due to the fact that my Isuzu FRR has an Air over Hydraulic Brake System" and not a full air braking system.

I may end up taking the skills test with a friends truck a trailer to get the full CLASS A .....since the "L" endorsement makes the license very limited for the future.

So my CT Commercial Drivers Manual given to me by the inspector is going to make for some interesting reading.

 

Shed some weight off of the CT 322 and put it in your truck - the loader bucket on that machine is likely more than 600lbs....you might have something else that can be removed easily and placed in the truck. You just made yourself in compliance

I wish it was that easy but the machine weighs in at 8300 lbs without a bucket !

Nothing else is removable.

 

where you live maybe? not in New York...read the print, once the trailer is over 10k, your in CDL land period. The tail wags the dog in NY and other locations. Dosent matter what the truck towing it is at that point.

Take it up with the contact name for further clarity - but how I wrote it here and said it is consistant

a class "D" is a regular operators license not a CDL. it says right it the print that you can tow over 10K as long as the combo is not over 26K. Class "B" is basicly for someone driving a dump truck that might pull a small equipment trailer
if your combo goes over 26K then you need a class "A"

 

where you live maybe? not in New York...read the print, once the trailer is over 10k, your in CDL land period. The tail wags the dog in NY and other locations. Dosent matter what the truck towing it is at that point.

Take it up with the contact name for further clarity - but how I wrote it here and said it is consistant

Suggest you point out in Non-CDL Class C and Class D license examples of where you are right. Because all of yours say that unless you are over 26K, you don't need that CDL. And just so the others here can see it if they don't have a way of seeing a pdf, they're copied below. It is the 26K+1 that wags the CDL dog, not the 12K trailer.

 

a class "D" is a regular operators license not a CDL. it says right it the print that you can tow over 10K as long as the combo is not over 26K. Class "B" is basicly for someone driving a dump truck that might pull a small equipment trailer
if your combo goes over 26K then you need a class "A"

I never mentioned class D, but since you brought it up and thats whats offered these days outside of a CDL - thats all you will need if your in NYS and your truck is under 26k, and your trailer is under 10k. If your trailer is over 10k, you need a CDL (pick the type after that point).

Now for the mathmatically changed - please add up the totals above. Ok I will do that for you. It equals 35,998 combined, however you can still use a regular class D license because your vehicle is under 26k, and your towed vehicle is under 10k as well.

Cant point it out any more clearer than that. Others have spelled it out the same way - It might not be clear enough from Motor vehicles documents but they dont interpret the law or write the tickets.

I would just contact the name and number in those pdf's and take issue with them or the ambiquity.

 

It is the 26K+1 that wags the CDL dog, not the 12K trailer.

Call the contact listed and tell them how you view it from out of state ( Florida). Here the trailer wags the dog, and thats that....did the upfront investigative work and wanted to share with NYS members only, since its directed to them. Dont like the ambiquity in their released document, take it up with them.

 

dude it says "may tow a vehicle with a GVWR of more than 10,000 provided the GCWR is less than 26,000" this means you can tow a 12,000 trailer with a F350 with an 11,000 GVWR with a class "D" which is a regular operator license.
If the combo is over 26000 then you need a CDL if the trailer is over 10k then you need a class"A".